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Author Topic: WICCAN VS WITCH  (Read 9594 times)

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oldghost

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #135 on: December 26, 2011, 10:13:41 PM »

When you no longer get to speak your mind or express your mind you become a slave , to not be able dispute your beliefs then you mite as well become a hermit. That is one of the wonderful things about Wicca and Witchcraft . there are so many different ways to pratice them . Arguments are find as long as they don't lead to bad feeling which can turn ugly.
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Michelle

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #136 on: December 27, 2011, 12:13:52 AM »

Well said Oldghost, and very true.
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marisol

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #137 on: January 08, 2012, 02:11:21 PM »

Also better to die free than as a slave.
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Michelle

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #138 on: January 09, 2012, 03:26:43 AM »

Also well said. And yet when I do voice an opinion I can often get jumped on. Sometimes (often really) such a thing can leave me feeling flat for days. I really don't take critisism well at all - must work on that.

Still Wicca Vs Witch - we could be here a long time.
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dark magus

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #139 on: January 09, 2012, 02:40:19 PM »

Also better to die free than as a slave.

To live as a slave, with hope for a chance to gain freedom again and to grind your oppressors face into the mud.
To die free......then what do you have
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C_A

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #140 on: January 09, 2012, 04:03:48 PM »

Still Wicca Vs Witch - we could be here a long time.

Nah.  It's covered.

Witches have existed, exist, and will continue to exist.  Cultures, religions and nations will come and they'll go.  As long as there are humans there will be witches.

As to Wicca, well...the downfall of Wicca is the same as plagues most of modern Paganism, and more wholly Neo-Paganism.  The seemingly incessant roll of people using it as a statement of fashion.  Or of teen-aged angst.  Or of rebellion, (read that: excuse for bad / aberrant behavior), for one "cause"  or another...ecology, politics,  animal rights, whatever.  Add in a hefty dose, (overdose?), of this implied malleability of tenet / dogma / scripture bordering on, (okay...sometimes crossing actively into), the profane;  proffered largely by "auteurs" with fat advance checks in their hands and multi-title contracts to fill, turning that which should be a sacred circle into a fast-food drive-thru.

I can tell you...the number of people leaving Neo-Paganism going TO Christianity is not only staggering, but makes my point.  People try "this", "that" or "the other" for a while and think: "I'm not as nearly fulfilled, Spiritually, as I thought I'd be...(or, as I was in that first year-and-a-day),.  Shucks.  Might just as well go back to church".  Probably makes much better Christians out of 'em. 

But that's not why we're here.

Nor should it be.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2012, 04:06:28 PM by C_A »
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C_A

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #141 on: January 10, 2012, 04:12:29 PM »

I split this thread.  The other half is where the continuance of the "Loss" derail is.

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“I’ve come to view Jesus much the way I view Elvis. I love the guy but the fan clubs really freak me out”  ~ John  Fugelsang.
You know that you've created your G-d in your own image and likeness when he hates all the same people as you do.

Michelle

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #142 on: January 12, 2012, 04:57:35 AM »

Well then, perhaps we like to argue about it not because we truly want to solve anything or even reach a popular consensus, but because a thread such as this just serves as a good enough excuse to just talk about something interesting.

At least I think so  :)
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Scorched Eartha

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #143 on: January 12, 2012, 04:51:01 PM »

Nah.  It's covered.

Witches have existed, exist, and will continue to exist.  Cultures, religions and nations will come and they'll go.  As long as there are humans there will be witches.

As to Wicca, well...the downfall of Wicca is the same as plagues most of modern Paganism, and more wholly Neo-Paganism.  The seemingly incessant roll of people using it as a statement of fashion.  Or of teen-aged angst.  Or of rebellion, (read that: excuse for bad / aberrant behavior), for one "cause"  or another...ecology, politics,  animal rights, whatever.  Add in a hefty dose, (overdose?), of this implied malleability of tenet / dogma / scripture bordering on, (okay...sometimes crossing actively into), the profane;  proffered largely by "auteurs" with fat advance checks in their hands and multi-title contracts to fill, turning that which should be a sacred circle into a fast-food drive-thru.

I can tell you...the number of people leaving Neo-Paganism going TO Christianity is not only staggering, but makes my point.  People try "this", "that" or "the other" for a while and think: "I'm not as nearly fulfilled, Spiritually, as I thought I'd be...(or, as I was in that first year-and-a-day),.  Shucks.  Might just as well go back to church".  Probably makes much better Christians out of 'em. 

But that's not why we're here.

Nor should it be.

The mainstream have done a fine job of co-opting the window dressing elements of Wicca, re-packaging them in a prime time format, corrupting the message utterly and profiting obscenely from the half hour sit-coms and one hour "dramas" that resulted from this unholy cocktail. Sabrina the Teenage Witch (aghhh  that creepy arsed stuffed cat!), Charmed, Paranormal, Angel & Buffy. The shyte "fiction" that crowds out the classics such as The Once and Future King and The Hobbit now on the Teen Reading shelves in bookshops.

The middle class path seeking hippies of the 60's did the same thing with the beauty and profundity of the Native American animist traditions. Invaded the Mojave in 1967 on their way home from Woodstock. Now that "path" is littered with SUV driving middle aged cherohonkees, peddling peyote to eager Alternative Lifestyle Lolitas in the hope of getting their ageing legover a bit of firm flesh. The plague of Billy Jack fanboys who rampaged through American deserts making out as if they knew what it was all about. They sicken me.

It was a deliberate ploy. I'm certain of it. Encouraged and maybe even funded by the ruling elites. They had noted a thirst in the kids. A need to re-connect to the old ways and the walk again the old paths. They knew they had to nip it in the bud or a populace with a growing consciousness, a deeper concept of Spirituality than monotheism can compete with and a widening understanding of our relationship with the earth which sustains us would have made us a much harder underclass to control.

Hollywood has always been the major tool of mind control in the western world. It's how they promote their wars. How they endorse their political ideologies. And increasingly how they mould and form the religious views of the many.

So they stole Wicca, they subverted its meanings, they polluted the lessons it has to teach and replaced them with inanity about spells and magic and what a circle or coven really is.  They held out to the tween target audience visions of romantic love with immortal life forms. Homework miraculously completed by the familiar. Rivals for the football player's heart bested with nothing more than information gleaned from a well cast set of runes. Or an esp insightful Tarot reading.

Now real practitioners of the craft have an even more uphill battle to try to convey to anyone - critic or potential student - that Wicca has nowt to do with any of that tripe.

I find it difficult to maintain my patience with anyone seeking to open a dialogue about Wicca who has obviously come across it by stepping straight off the path behind a backlot in West Hollywood, still clutching the autograph they got off some  smokin' hot teen femme fatale from the shitty little show from whence they got their ludicrous notions.

My two cents worth.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2012, 05:15:59 PM by Scorched Eartha »
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oldghost

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #144 on: January 12, 2012, 10:03:41 PM »

Cherokee's . Sorry kid wrong area , Navajo , Zuni,Ute, and several others. Not picking on you , just letting you know. Of them the real one have not lose their way . Have meet older and younger Navajo and Zuni that will not even speak American . The old ways are not gone it's only the greed that ruins things.
 
Soon , maybe not in my life time but soon , the old ways will come back .
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Scorched Eartha

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #145 on: January 13, 2012, 01:43:49 AM »

Cherohonkees lovely. It's a pejorative term for any white middle class trend following type of new age hippie wanker  who thinks a dream catcher, a fecthing turquoise necklace and an ambition to take a shyte load of peyote trips make you someone who is fit to tread the Native American path.

It's a gross insult to that type of cretin in fact.
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If you're going to be crazy, you have to get paid for it or else you're going to be locked up.

You better take care of me Lord, if you don't you're gonna have me on your hands.

The Edge there's no honest way to explain it as the only people who really know where it is have gone over.

Michelle

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #146 on: January 13, 2012, 02:12:27 AM »

Ok, so I'm a cretin. I admit to knowing very little about Wicca, witches, the Old Ways, and even less about The Gods themselves.

I enjoy watching Harry Potter and think it would be great if Hogworts was a real school and I could go.

But that's just the little-girl in me, the person who so wants to discover that fairies are really real and some form of magic does exist in this often awful world.

So as a cretin I will tread all those alternative pathways, I will try that peyote whatever it is, and I will listen enraptured to the new-age hippie-wanker as he talks as if he's "been everywhere man".

And why?

Because to know the truth, one must wade through a lot of bullshit.  ;)

Long live the VW Combi.
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Doom Monkey

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #147 on: January 13, 2012, 07:16:24 AM »

I have never felt is necessary to wade thru the bullshit to find what I'm looking for.  I've found myself in the middle of it unexpectedly and had to wade out, but if it tickled my shit-o-meter from the get go I have always had enough faith in myself to just walk away from sheer stupidity.

It sounds noble, what you are saying, but in reality is it?  Or is it a waste of your time?  If you know the guy is some new-age hippie-wanker, why waste his time or yours?  Do you honestly believe in the possible hours of neverending crap you will find a single nugget of wisdom?  Is that nugget truly worth the agony of the rest?
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marisol

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #148 on: January 13, 2012, 10:26:41 AM »

my mother's side of the family are first people(Cherokee). MY great grandma taught me to rain
dance when I was 5 yrs old. She could dance around a campfire like you wouldn't believe when she was eighty. She  was always happy and told me wonderful stories. My grandmother was not
a happy person, she embraced her husbands life. Great grandma Firefly lived the old ways. So, in my opinion they are best.
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Doom Monkey

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Re: WICCAN VS WITCH
« Reply #149 on: January 13, 2012, 12:56:21 PM »

I have to agree marisol.  My grandparents lived that way and were all happy, healthy and long lived.  My parents turned to the christian church among a lot of other "worldly" options and both were dead at 62.
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