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Author Topic: The Goddess and the God  (Read 2754 times)

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LadyOfShalott

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The Goddess and the God
« on: October 02, 2015, 07:48:54 AM »

Questions, questions, questions! I keep coming up with more. (I found a thread that answered part of my question, but it was locked :( )

So, the only books I've read on Wicca are Scott Cunningham's. I have more on the way, but his views and what I've read here are all I'm going on at the moment.

But! S.C. talks about worship of the God and Goddess is a must in Wicca (if you're not worshiping both, you're not wiccan), and he talks about how they're equals. From what I've read here, it seems many people are in agreement.

My question is: What aspects do you attribute to the God and Goddess? I know the answers will be a very varied, because there are so many paths, traditions, and opinions, but it seems to me that the Goddess has way more aspects attributed to her, and the God seems a little under-appreciated (S.C. touches on why he thinks that is). I'd love to know how people balance the two, how they make the distinctions.

Example: The God is attributed to the Sun, and I've seen the Goddess connected with the stars. Stars are suns, so why wouldn't they be the God's territory? Or maybe they are in some people's practices! That's what I'm trying to find out. :)

I've seen tons of information on the Goddess, and I'm trying find more about the God so I can start figuring out what I think about both!

I still don't know that I believe in either as sentient beings; I'm kind of stuck on the idea that they're constructs/manifestations for male and female aspects of the Universe, together making up the Oneness, the All, supreme creative force, etc. But someone mentioned (I believe it was Ashe) that this felt like a thinly veiled monotheism and made them uncomfortable. I'd love more viewpoints on this as well.

Thanks! ~Lady~
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Ashe Isadora

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2015, 08:25:31 AM »

You don't have to see them as sentient beings, that's fine.  Many see them as archetypes, metaphors, projections of human qualities or other things. Your understanding of what is "sentient" may change however, as time passes.

Now the question about the stars actually representing the god is very, very interesting.  I've never heard that before, and that's a good one! I can tell you that in Neopaganism the Star Goddess is out there, but you challenge me  The role of our sun in fertility and growth seems to equate it with maleness, where the stars play no role in fertility that I know of.  This would be my answer, but I'd welcome other explanations.

It's really impressive when seekers come up with unusual questions.  Keep'em coming.

« Last Edit: October 02, 2015, 08:43:38 AM by Ashe Isadora »
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LadyOfShalott

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2015, 09:11:32 AM »

In there own galaxies they do, right? We've found hundreds upon hundred of earth-like planets, and they couldn't be earth-like without a sun similar to ours. :) I've been thinking of it this way, mostly because I always end up doing my rituals at night, and I wanted to connect the God more firmly into them, and it just made sense to me.

And I'm very glad to be providing interesting food for thought (and not coming off as annoying!). 
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Ashe Isadora

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2015, 09:26:21 AM »

Yes, but our religion, if you are Wiccan or Wiccan inspired, is tied to the fertility of the Earth. Other planets can have their own fertility. religion LOL.  No reason you can't incorporate the stars into your ritual or have your own rationale if you're solitary, though.
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LadyOfShalott

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2015, 09:27:56 AM »

Yes, but our religion, if you are Wiccan or Wiccan inspired, is tied to the fertility of the Earth. Other planets can have their own fertility. religion LOL.  No reason you can't incorporate the stars into your ritual or have your own rationale if you're solitary, though.

I didn't think about it like that. Here I am, imposing my religious views on some poor unsuspecting planet!  ;D :-p
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Alchymist

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2015, 04:59:50 PM »

What kind of religion would develop on other planets is an interesting question, although perhaps not terribly relevant to us here on Earth - more of an intellectual exercise, then.......

What kind of religion would develop on a planet with more than one moon? Would each moon have its own God or Goddess (here in our own system, Uranus has 27 moons at the last count - all named after Shakespearian characters)? And what about a planet orbiting a double or triple star? Things could get very complicated, very quickly.....

OK, don't mind me, carry on......

Alchymist.
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LadyOfShalott

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #6 on: October 03, 2015, 12:21:09 PM »

What kind of religion would develop on other planets is an interesting question, although perhaps not terribly relevant to us here on Earth - more of an intellectual exercise, then.......

What kind of religion would develop on a planet with more than one moon? Would each moon have its own God or Goddess (here in our own system, Uranus has 27 moons at the last count - all named after Shakespearian characters)? And what about a planet orbiting a double or triple star? Things could get very complicated, very quickly.....

OK, don't mind me, carry on......

Alchymist.

Exactly the sorts of thoughts I find myself tangled in on a regular basis.  :-p I think you're right, it's good mental exercise.
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Draconis Rex

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2015, 01:11:36 PM »

What kind of religion would develop on other planets is an interesting question, although perhaps not terribly relevant to us here on Earth - more of an intellectual exercise, then.......

What kind of religion would develop on a planet with more than one moon? Would each moon have its own God or Goddess (here in our own system, Uranus has 27 moons at the last count - all named after Shakespearian characters)? And what about a planet orbiting a double or triple star? Things could get very complicated, very quickly.....

OK, don't mind me, carry on......

Alchymist.

I would add to this the hypothesis that there may be other planets which have more than the two genders we have... How indeed would these be represented?
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Ashe Isadora

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #8 on: October 03, 2015, 01:19:22 PM »

Robert Heinlein's  Stranger In A Strange Land, about a human raised on Mars among Martians, touched on these possibilities.  And that book begat a whole Neopagan religion, The Church Of All Worlds.  CAW has had great influence on our whole community, and any here might enjoy Stranger In A Strange Land if you haven't already read it.  Great book.
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Draconis Rex

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #9 on: October 03, 2015, 02:00:23 PM »

It occurs to me that I haven't read a Heinlein book since I was in my very early twenties.
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LadyOfShalott

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #10 on: October 03, 2015, 02:41:22 PM »

Robert Heinlein's  Stranger In A Strange Land, about a human raised on Mars among Martians, touched on these possibilities.  And that book begat a whole Neopagan religion, The Church Of All Worlds.  CAW has had great influence on our whole community, and any here might enjoy Stranger In A Strange Land if you haven't already read it.  Great book.

I have read it! Though it was quite a long time ago. I remember liking it, but not much else. I'll have to revisit it!
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LadyOfShalott

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #11 on: October 03, 2015, 02:48:24 PM »

You don't have to see them as sentient beings, that's fine.  Many see them as archetypes, metaphors, projections of human qualities or other things. Your understanding of what is "sentient" may change however, as time passes.

Going back to an earlier post, Ashe, your comment has made me pause. 1: it makes me feel more comfortable with feeling unsure (perhaps, skeptical), and 2: makes me curious how my thoughts and opinions will change the more I practice and learn.

I battle with feeling "I think that was a sign!" and "It was neat, but you're reading too much into it!" I'm trying to give the podium to both voices equally(so, I'm looking too hard, or ignoring the obvious!). :)
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Draconis Rex

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #12 on: October 03, 2015, 03:16:59 PM »

A very common mistake is that once many start to seek a Pagan path, they are often caught up in the "this happened is it a sign?" or "I found this on my doorstep, am I being told something?" etc. One thing we must try to remember is that most times occurrences are more often mundane in nature. Trying to assign occult reasoning can often cause confusion. By all means be aware that a message could in fact be hidden there, but be equally aware this is not always the case.
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Ashe Isadora

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #13 on: October 04, 2015, 02:58:55 AM »

Drac, I'm close to agreeing with you but not 100 per cent.  True, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.  But the gods communicate through symbols and often in a very experiential way.  So it's not so much "Did the god(s) send that flock of birds as a sign?" as "Why is this grabbing my attention right now?  Is there something Someone wants me to notice?".  Then make a note of other similar experiences and see if you can tie them together somehow.  It isn't WHAT you're experiencing, it's HOW you're interpreting it. Then ask yourself WHY.  The universe can have very roundabout ways of communicating.

I will go out on a limb on one phenomenon, though.  When you're new to the Craft, it's common to find just the item you need either free or at just the right price, as if the universe is handing you little gifts.  This happened for me and many people I've talked to.  Don't assume every little thing is a gift from the gods, but keep your eyes open and pay attention.

Drac has a slightly more conservative view on this than I do, I think.  Personally I'd say pay attention to coincidences and anything unusual, but don't make assumptions. Meditate, and keep a journal of your dreams at this time.

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LadyOfShalott

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Re: The Goddess and the God
« Reply #14 on: October 04, 2015, 01:00:19 PM »

A very common mistake is that once many start to seek a Pagan path, they are often caught up in the "this happened is it a sign?" or "I found this on my doorstep, am I being told something?" etc. One thing we must try to remember is that most times occurrences are more often mundane in nature. Trying to assign occult reasoning can often cause confusion. By all means be aware that a message could in fact be hidden there, but be equally aware this is not always the case.

Drac, I agree in that it's easy to look too hard, or read too deeply, especially when one (me!!) is very interested and excited about this whole process. :) I'm trying to keep a level head about it all, though  :-p
 
Drac, I'm close to agreeing with you but not 100 per cent.  True, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.  But the gods communicate through symbols and often in a very experiential way.  So it's not so much "Did the god(s) send that flock of birds as a sign?" as "Why is this grabbing my attention right now?  Is there something Someone wants me to notice?".  Then make a note of other similar experiences and see if you can tie them together somehow.  It isn't WHAT you're experiencing, it's HOW you're interpreting it. Then ask yourself WHY.  The universe can have very roundabout ways of communicating.

I will go out on a limb on one phenomenon, though.  When you're new to the Craft, it's common to find just the item you need either free or at just the right price, as if the universe is handing you little gifts.  This happened for me and many people I've talked to.  Don't assume every little thing is a gift from the gods, but keep your eyes open and pay attention.

Drac has a slightly more conservative view on this than I do, I think.  Personally I'd say pay attention to coincidences and anything unusual, but don't make assumptions. Meditate, and keep a journal of your dreams at this time.

Ashe, that is what I've been trying to do. Write down everything to think about more, and definitely asking, "Why does this seem important?" At the last full moon I was really tired (working waaay too much) and told my boyfriend, "I think I need sleep more than a ritual tonight," but we still had a fire before bed, and while zoning out, I saw something in the fire that, well, just seemed too clear to be coincidence. 

It wasn't one of those, "Oh, this kind of looked like such-and-such for a second. Neat!"  But "Wow. That's unlikely, and incredible." I drew a picture before bed, and the image has continued to pop into my head for days. Still trying to figure out what it meant!
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